Tattooing & Piercing is Fashion Freedom

[ziggy_encaoua]

Some say that tattooing & body piercing are not any part of fashion freedom however I disagree. Sure tattooing & piercing are technically forms of body modification but tattooing & piercing are historically forms of self expression just as the quest for fashion freedom. This is why I decide to invest effort in constructing a directory of tattooing & piercing studios on Defiant Angel, which I’m now expanding to aid any individual wanting to use ink & metal to make their own fashion statement.
http://defiant-angel.com/studio_index.htm
So if anyone can suggest a studio for inclusion please do tell.

[Departed Member]

Ziggy, you say, "tattooing & piercing are historically forms of self expression just as the quest for fashion freedom". That seems remarkably contradictory to me! Whilst personally, I dislike both 'body art' formats, folk have been free to 'express' themselves (or rather, someone else's 'expression'!) in such a manner, for well over half a century, certainly throughout Europe.

I am deeply saddened that even my small town can support three such 'studios'. My wife was 'persuaded' (by the same cretins who sought to turn her against male skirting) to have her ears pierced as 'an act of rebellion' against me. It didn't work - no reaction, what-so-ever. However, she, like many others, still has infection/bleeding problems. I don't need to say, "Told you so!"

Fashion Freedom is about pushing boundaries, not about personal disfigurement (Oops! Did I mean 'body art'?).

[Milfmog]

I tend to agree with Ziggy in the sense that if people want to use body piercing or tattoos as a part of their visual image they should be free to do so.

However I also agree with Merlin in that I personally dislike the look of tattoos. I have less aversion to the more common piercings than I used to have, ears and navels don't really register now but eyebrows, lower lips, tongues all tend to repulse me slightly (although I recognise that this is illogical and I should try not to prejudge people by their fashion choices). As for some of the more "intimate" piercings that are available, the idea makes my eyes water but at least I don't have to see those.

I guess I'm just an old fogey who doesn't understand the fashion choices of youngsters... [sigh].

Have fun,


Ian.

[Charlie]

My wife was 'persuaded' (by the same cretins who sought to turn her against male skirting) to have her ears pierced as 'an act of rebellion' against me.

Oh .... didn't realise that my wife, daughter and mother were all rebelling - they all have pierced ears Or have I missed something?

Charlie

[ziggy_encaoua]

Fashion Freedom is about pushing boundaries, not about personal disfigurement (Oops! Did I mean 'body art'?).

so your saying that anybody who is tattooed of pierced is disfigured right?

Well in that case you wear a skirt…..so you must be a tranny

Suggest you should be a little less judgemental & a bit more open minded

[Departed Member]

Oh .... didn't realise that my wife, daughter and mother were all rebelling - they all have pierced ears Or have I missed something? Charlie

No, Charlie! I've never liked the look of piercings of any sort (too fond of natural beauty?), to be honest, although it's entirely up to the person's own judgment whether they indulge. My wife's (then) 'chums' thought it would be 'fun' to attempt to spite me, by cajoling her into having her ears 'done' (and thus hopefully start a row!). They were very disappointed! When she found out what had been going on (there was lots more!), to her credit, she 'dumped' them! She's subsequently had quite a few problems with infections, but is determined to persevere - her choice, at the end of the day!

so your saying that anybody who is tattooed of pierced is disfigured right?

Don't like quoting myself, but "folk have been free to 'express' themselves .......... in such a manner"

Well in that case you wear a skirt…..so you must be a tranny

Uhuh? Right. Your point is what, precisely.......?

Suggest you should be a little less judgemental & a bit more open minded

Read my posts a little more throughly first! I'm as entitled to express my observations as you are to open the discussion. I have no interest in making judgments - period. Please don't resort to 'taking a pop' because someone may hold a different viewpoint. Some of my friends (& former colleagues) have adorned themselves with various pieces of metal, in one case, through parts of the body, that must remain forever private! When asked, "Why?", most have replied, "Because Billy/Julie/Whoever had it done!"

[ziggy_encaoua]

Well in that case you wear a skirt…..so you must be a tranny

Uhuh? Right. Your point is what, precisely.......?

That you were being judgement & passing judgement upon unfounded logic about bodyart (as you called ‘disfigurement’) yet you’d not like it if somebody did the same to you about wearing a skirt.

[The Satirist]

Sure tattooing & piercing are technically forms of body modification but tattooing & piercing are historically forms of self expression just as the quest for fashion freedom.

Historically, if you go back far enough, tattoos and piercing were a tribal means of fitting in and looking like the others at a certain stage of life. (It's too involved to explain it all here.) For a long time they were shunned as being relegated to outsiders, eg. bikers and sailors. Only recently have they been socially accepted as a form of self expression, but for the most part they are still shunned in the professional and corporate world.

Not an argument, Just saying...

[ziggy_encaoua]

Only recently have they been socially accepted as a form of self expression, but for the most part they are still shunned in the professional and corporate world.

Its more acceptable then it was however the corporate world will always try to crish individual expression & as long as they do the longer I'll fight them.

[Departed Member]

That you were being judgement & passing judgement upon unfounded logic about bodyart (as you called ‘disfigurement’) yet you’d not like it if somebody did the same to you about wearing a skirt.

Sorry! To quote a modern catchphrase, "Do I look bovvered? I AIN'T bovvered!" If some simpleton wants to call me a 'tranny', it's their problem, NOT mine! (Although why they would want to call me a 'twin-engined military transport plane' is beyond me! )

There's a whole world of difference between making personal remarks about/to a specific person and expressing a open viewpoint (whether an opinion, or nay) about a particular (current) 'fashion' trend. "I wish I hadn't!" in relation to tattoos, is a phrase, over the years, I've heard more than a few dozen times. Even my late father-in-law, who had had loads of tattoos done (& some were certainly artistic) while serving in the Army during WW2, regretted (most of!) them. In NO way am I passing judgment - it's their choice - they are free to make it. Not so long ago, you couldn't join the Police Force if you had visible tattoos - THAT's judgment - isn't it?

Is it disfigurement? If it's permanent, then of course it is! Once you alter what Nature has ordained, unless it's for medical/phsychological reasons ('plastic' surgery for burns, etc.), then it falls into such a category - whether the artwork is (& I've seen some fascinating & intricate tattoos!), 'top of the range' or not. As others have mentioned, it has its roots in tribal 'marking' - as valid today as it was thousands of years ago.

[Bob]

I'm sorry I did not get involved in this thread earlier.

This forum is about skirts and fashion freedom in general, and that includes body piercing to some extent. It is of utmost importance that we respect each other's body and fashion choices, even if we would not choose them ourselves. It is also important that we respect each others' personal expression on our personal websites.

Thank you, ziggy_encaoua, for showing us the world of body piercing. I have personally enjoyed watching your site as you build it up.

The word "disfigurement" is loaded, and I request that we stop using it.

[Departed Member]

I'm not sure I can agree with you, Bob. If this otherwise excellent website is to be encouraged to go down a road that most of us are likely to feel uncomfortable with, then the future is bleak. I've always thought we were a responsible community here - I hope I'm not mistaken. I see no correlation between the subject matter and 'Fashion Freedom' in the context of the declared purpose (at the top of the page) of the Forum. Freedom to (permanently) decorate one's body has existed for very many years, as others have also noted. A couple of my friends/colleagues have indulged in some bizarre manifestations, & happily acknowledge that fact! Their body, their choice, their consequences.

Perhaps you've been lucky and haven't seen friends/colleagues (including the ones mentioned above) suffer from injuries/infections caused by piercing or tattooing. If you prefer not to refer to them as a "disfigurement", then I would respectfully ask what alternative description you would find acceptable. Thousands of folk every year suffer blood poisoning, septicaemia or worse from tattoos that 'go wrong', never mind piercings, and this is despite stringent hygiene regulations now in force. (One of our 'drinking chums' works in a tattoo parlour!) How many here have seen the after effects of having an infected tattoo 'removed'?

[Skirt Chaser]

If you prefer not to refer to them as a "disfigurement", then I would respectfully ask what alternative description you would find acceptable.

I think 'body modification' is a pretty standard label without the bias. That avoids the judgement call inherent in 'disfigurement' since that means spoiling and changes certainly are not inherently the ruination of a body.

Quiet Mouse

[Departed Member]

Taken from the Wikipedia site, the following quote, "The term "disfigurement" is sometimes used pejoratively to describe the results of intentional body modification." Whilst I accept that people, of their own free will, can and do, mess with their bodies, does not mean that their decision(s) must be universally accepted by others.

As for 'disfigurement', I would add a little to something I mentioned earlier. Apart from my wife's father, the only other member of her family to have a tattoo was a Polish aunt who married into the family. She had had a tattoo of which she was deeply ashamed. She'd had it since a little girl, and it had been done for free. It was in the form of a number and was done at a place called Dachau.....................

[ziggy_encaoua]

I have personally enjoyed watching your site as you build it up.

Thanks for the praise its much appreciated