Difficulties with partners

[Sinned]

Thank you, I’m getting rather fond of you all and touched reading your kind words and advice. Considering that we have never met you are a source of strength for me and I do listen to you. I am just a little saddened that there are so many miles between us.

Now, having got that out of the way, this morning was a bit uncomfortable for us but the day got better. A friend has come for the weekend, she’s a G.P. in Belgium and we have known her since the mid-1980’s – she came to us as an English language student for 3 weeks each summer and we have kept in touch. Anyway, they all came into my store this morning and things seemed more normal ( MOH bought a cushion insert for 1p, yes one penny, and no I didn’t mark that one up ). They are not back yet but I suspect that things will be ok tonight. Like Moon and Jenn we have blowouts but MOH seems to recover and “forget” – do women ever forget, sorry Jenn – quicker than I do. So I think M & J will understand this. I think that there are reasons why we have lasted 40 years and this latest episode illustrates this, that our love for each other overcomes any disagreements.

Aside: I know that she isn’t serious because this morning she ordered a DVD set from ebay that will take lots of time to watch. She wouldn’t do that if she was going to leave!

So, don’t fret too much I don’t think that we’ll be separating anytime soon. Her, one sided, “agreement” with me ( I had my fingers crossed behind my back ) was that I could wear a skirt around her but not too often and I think that will continue. I have proved that I can wear a skirt outside without her ok and the world hasn’t stopped and whether I can repeat this anytime soon is still open. Until we can talk a bit tonight I won’t know the answer to this one. In this situation I believe in baby steps and on Thursday I took one and maybe my birthday meal will be the next one, time will tell. I don’t know if my youngest son heard what I said and I will be interested in his reaction and my daughter’s, she will get to know.

Carl, Fred, Moon, Ray and Tom thanks for listening and the advice. I have been contained, as most men are, and I am rebelling a little but I won’t throw away the 40 years’ investment. Yes, Carl, this is trivial in comparison to losing a son to leukaemia. This was akin to your losing Sapphire, I guess, as both were very tragic events and caused so much pain. Such are orders of magnitude more serious and we came through that as a family so I’m sure that we can endure some more.

Anyway, I’ll close and watch this space, there are bound to be more posts.

[Kilty]

Dennis, well done for securing permission to skirt on her terms and conditions. Every little helps

I know it's a difficult tightrope to tread but I wouldn't have your patience. Just continue skirting as you see fit, people just have to accept your sartorial choice. Making too many allowances for others at the expense of oneself isn't ideal, IMHO

[Elisabetta]

Thank you, I’m getting rather fond of you all and touched reading your kind words and advice. Considering that we have never met you are a source of strength for me and I do listen to you. I am just a little saddened that there are so many miles between us.

Now, having got that out of the way, this morning was a bit uncomfortable for us but the day got better. A friend has come for the weekend, she’s a G.P. in Belgium and we have known her since the mid-1980’s – she came to us as an English language student for 3 weeks each summer and we have kept in touch. Anyway, they all came into my store this morning and things seemed more normal ( MOH bought a cushion insert for 1p, yes one penny, and no I didn’t mark that one up ). They are not back yet but I suspect that things will be ok tonight. Like Moon and Jenn we have blowouts but MOH seems to recover and “forget” – do women ever forget, sorry Jenn – quicker than I do. So I think M & J will understand this. I think that there are reasons why we have lasted 40 years and this latest episode illustrates this, that our love for each other overcomes any disagreements.

Aside: I know that she isn’t serious because this morning she ordered a DVD set from ebay that will take lots of time to watch. She wouldn’t do that if she was going to leave!

So, don’t fret too much I don’t think that we’ll be separating anytime soon. Her, one sided, “agreement” with me ( I had my fingers crossed behind my back ) was that I could wear a skirt around her but not too often and I think that will continue. I have proved that I can wear a skirt outside without her ok and the world hasn’t stopped and whether I can repeat this anytime soon is still open. Until we can talk a bit tonight I won’t know the answer to this one. In this situation I believe in baby steps and on Thursday I took one and maybe my birthday meal will be the next one, time will tell. I don’t know if my youngest son heard what I said and I will be interested in his reaction and my daughter’s, she will get to know.

Carl, Fred, Moon, Ray and Tom thanks for listening and the advice. I have been contained, as most men are, and I am rebelling a little but I won’t throw away the 40 years’ investment. Yes, Carl, this is trivial in comparison to losing a son to leukaemia. This was akin to your losing Sapphire, I guess, as both were very tragic events and caused so much pain. Such are orders of magnitude more serious and we came through that as a family so I’m sure that we can endure some more.

Anyway, I’ll close and watch this space, there are bound to be more posts.

Dennis,,

As I read your post daily I think I'm understanding your wife a bit. I think ( Maybe I'm wrong just an observation) that your wife feels she's losing you a bit. Losing you to your own Independence. Things like that scare woman such as your wife when their in control and lose that hand on things. HOWEVER. You are actually making great progress believe it or not. Try baby steps here and there. Don't over do it or worn your welcome out and watch how it nicely unfolds to her accepting it all the way. Patience always remember patience. Trust me I know easier said than done but you my friend are getting there. As you posted about she said you can be skirted around her just not too often. That's a start and that is where it all goes. Your wife indeed loves you as I know you love her. However we are all human and have those breaking points when our significant others piss us off. Moon can really make me mad sometimes but in the 13 years we've been together I can honestly say we actually talk more out of our asses than we do being serious. We play that Divorce card sometimes too but in all seriousness EVERYONE plays it when their mad. I honestly think your wife has no intentions of leaving you or you leaving her. It's all about who will cave in first. I think maybe you're both a bit stubborn sometimes I know me and Moon are. Regardless Dennis I sure do hope this is the start of jumping them hurdles and mastering them. Prayers to you and keep it up you are on your way to being a very independent all the time Skirt wearer. Pat yourself on the back brother you done very well!

[crfriend]

Like Moon and Jenn we have blowouts but MOH seems to recover and “forget” – do women ever forget, sorry Jenn – quicker than I do.

From personal experience, I do not believe that women ever forget, much less forgive. Men are aces at the craft, but based on what I've been put through I'd posit that most women have the ability to hold grudges for decades and then pull one out just to twist the knife they've stuck between your ribs.

From a personal perspective, as a guy, I am willing to forgive many things; however that does not mean that I will forget them. That said, if I've forgiven something, I'll not bring it back up later on to wound another or to gain ground in an argument. Bringing up a forgiven transgression seems, to me at least, a solely feminine trait which men fortunately eschew. Once forgiven, it should remain that way; to dredge it back up as an accusation later on in life is entirely without honour and can only cause needless pain and suffering.

Other folks' experiences may, obviously, differ.

I really hope you two sort it out.

[Sinned]

Dennis, well done for securing permission to skirt on her terms and conditions. Every little helps

I know it's a difficult tightrope to tread but I wouldn't have your patience. Just continue skirting as you see fit, people just have to accept your sartorial choice. Making too many allowances for others at the expense of oneself isn't ideal, IMHO

Kilty, your comment was so unexpected that it really made the start of my day, and it’s only just begun, and just about brought the tears to my eyes. How true, and also how absurd it seems put like that. And unfair but it's something I choose to live with for the moment. As for patience, it's my middle name. Not.

Well, things are back to normal and as usual no comment about what has happened or the elephant. Apparently, family and our friend all went to a meal in a local restaurant and texted and called for me to join them. But since my mobile is permanently on silent mode because I work in a store I didn’t hear the ringtones and didn’t join them. So I sort of got upbraided for that. I’ll not know where I stand until I next wear a skirt or try to wear it outside. She may relent a little or not. Baby steps.

Jenn, Moon is lucky to have such a remarkable woman in his life ( if you feel like emigrating .... Only joking, Moon ) what you say makes sense and thanks for being encouraging. You are probably right about the threatening Tammy Wynette thing but the threats always come from her. I would NEVER consider leaving, I love her too much and realise it would be devastating for both of us. Actually, if she feels that she is losing me, then it is her blatant opposition that is causing it and if she was accepting then I would love her all the more for it. Yes, she is stubborn and so am I in some areas, others not, so it’s the immovable meeting the irresistible, so to speak. It could just now be pride or not wanting to be seen to have given in that is now the hurdle. Yes, I do feel that I am making progress and go out skirted when she is not around, I just don’t think that she knows, or wants to know, how much and where. Our dentist, the doctors, the chemist, local shops/stores, my workplace are just a few. I don’t say and she doesn’t ask because it’s not easy even broaching the subject. Patience is something I have a lot of, obviously, and she will come around, even if she doesn’t know it yet. The bit about independence is a bit ironic in a way. When she was at home with her parents they were quite strict about her behaviour and with me she has as much independence as she wants to have. I don’t place restrictions on her, want to know where she is or has been all the time but she generally tells me anyway, and let her spend as she feels she needs to do. So when you posit the reverse it has made me wonder and think what I can do about it. She is definitely the more dominant in the partnership which has been a gradual development over the 40 years and in most cases I am fine with it. But occasionally ....

Carl, I agree with what you say but I must say that MOH doesn’t have the guile in her to use my past indiscretions against me ( very often ). I have trouble remembering what I did yesterday, less 6 months or more ago. I know that we will sort it out. The only aspect that involves the eggshells about all this is the situation with my youngest son and his children, daughter and son, from his first marriage. They live in Bristol which is at the other side of the country and quite a bit south, quite a long drive. When he has them for the usual holiday visits they get upset when they have to go back. Anyway the daughter is approaching 11 and going to secondary school soon and he feels that they are getting old enough to make the decision and this is a significant breakpoint so is going to ask them if they want to live with him and his new partner permanently or stay with their mother. As far as I know neither of them know that I wear a skirt, by agreement we have kept this from them and I don’t think my daughter’s children have said anything, as the daughter, a remarkably forthright individual, would let the cat slip and their mother would use that against my son to make me appear deviant in any legalities. When things get settled then the scenario changes. I know that this is a concern for MOH. I know that we will sort it out amicably .... in my favour but under terms where she thinks it's under her terms .... and mine. Heh, heh, haaaargh laugh and twists hands.

You have to have a sense of humour in such times.

Well, the sun is out, the sky is blue there’s not a cloud to spoil the view ....

[Ray]

Dennis, you're not alone. I hope that the Café is giving you the support you deserve.

Here's hoping you can find some sort of accommodation with your wife. Isn't it amazing what the mere wearing of a tubular garment will do to someone?

[bobmoore]

If they don't like my style, let them look elsewhere.

Exactly!

[Fred in Skirts]

Dennis,

I continue to hope and pray for the best for you and your other half. When you get the family matters straightened out maybe she will begin to see the light. I hope for your sake.

Fred

[Grok]

Dennis,

I continue to hope and pray for the best for you and your other half. When you get the family matters straightened out maybe she will begin to see the light. I hope for your sake.

Fred

I agree!

Good luck.

[Kilty]

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Dennis, well done for securing permission to skirt on her terms and conditions. Every little helps

I know it's a difficult tightrope to tread but I wouldn't have your patience. Just continue skirting as you see fit, people just have to accept your sartorial choice. Making too many allowances for others at the expense of oneself isn't ideal, IMHO

Kilty, your comment was so unexpected that it really made the start of my day, and it’s only just begun, and just about brought the tears to my eyes. How true, and also how absurd it seems put like that. And unfair but it's something I choose to live with for the moment. As for patience, it's my middle name. Not.

Well, things are back to normal and as usual no comment about what has happened or the elephant...

Your house must be huge to have an elephant my estate agent would have a fit if I had any sorts of pets where I am

Don't worry, other halves can be stubborn, but eventually they back down. Would slightly longer knee-length denim skirts help, I have a Next pencil skirt in indigo that could pass as shorts, as most people will assume any guy with legs exposed and not in trousers must be in shorts there is this invisible element of denim skirts I like, and the straight cut ones are quite masculine along with the material. This pic of a guy on a German skirt forum is a good example of skirts for men and how smart it can look.

Something like that might suffice and once everyone is acclimatised to the skirts, then by all means wear something flashier or a little shorter

[Sinned]

Kilty, I have over 100 skirts in all sorts of colours, lengths, materials, sizes and styles. Like others on this site when passing a charity shop I just can't resist dropping in and if they have a nice skirt in ....

BTW the elephant was short for the elephant in the room that everyone can see but no-one wants to be the one to mention that it's there, so they all ignore it. The skirt wearing outside is MOH's elephant, stood there minding its own business, looking around and whistling nonchalantly. It's any skirt that she has trouble with. I have denim skirt from knee-length and above.

Thanks Fred and Grok for your good wishes. Support from all of you keeps me going. Today has been a good day.

[moonshadow]

The other 800 lb elephant in the room is the fact that women can choose from either side without all this fuss and commotion.

[Kilty]

Kilty, I have over 100 skirts in all sorts of colours, lengths, materials, sizes and styles. Like others on this site when passing a charity shop I just can't resist dropping in and if they have a nice skirt in ....

BTW the elephant was short for the elephant in the room that everyone can see but no-one wants to be the one to mention that it's there, so they all ignore it. The skirt wearing outside is MOH's elephant, stood there minding its own business, looking around and whistling nonchalantly. It's any skirt that she has trouble with. I have denim skirt from knee-length and above.

Thanks Fred and Grok for your good wishes. Support from all of you keeps me going. Today has been a good day.

Haha, I was being facetious... I know about the elephant in the room 100 skirts which ones does she have trouble with? Is it the shorter girlish ones or can it just be any one that sets her off depending on the atmosphere if there's tension? Why not post a pic and we could critique / give feedback on what could work so you can skirt with a little more acceptance? Once it becomes a daily thing, she will lose interest and stop going on about it

[STEVIE]

Hi All,
Nice try at using humour to lighten the tone but we are in hard times here.
A partner who truly objects does not differentiate in terms of any style.
She will not be persuaded by any variation in length, colour or whatever!
I'm kind of lucky, my wife ignores my skirts.
Not ideal but it works, so far.
Flipside is that I did not have to attend the worst wedding of the year.
Reality, Sinned, I feel for you both!
Could you persuade her to visit for a "latte", I'm fairly sure Mrs. Kennedy would never agree either.
Jenn, any ideas?
Steve.

[Sinned]

Hi Steve, I wondered when we would get a contribution from you as I know that you are in a similar position and thanks for your words. I have been waiting for your missive with bated breath. You are right in that it is just the garment and not any particular colour, length, material, size or style - she just says that she sees woman when she sees skirt. I am going to try, without any guarantee of success, and slowly persuade her to think of the skirt as not the woman's province any more, partly on the basis of probably the majority of women not wearing one any more, but also on the evidence of an increasing use among men. I have articles from several sites that I will try and get her to read and it will be a major achievement just to get her to read them. I have heard a side-remark by SHMBO that she thinks that I do have some crap skirts and maybe I have and I can work with her on weeding out which ones she thinks are not worthy. My main problem is that it is not easy even broaching the subject without an adverse reaction, something akin to a mushroom cloud. I do agree that I get a lot of ignoring particularly on the I wear them outside when she is not around topic I think because she has absolutely no control at all. I have to go down to the doctor's surgery and the chemist and she must KNOW that I will be going out in a skirt but no mention of it when she left this morning for work.

Kilty, do you seriously want me to post photos of me wearing all my skirts? I have started posting particular looks and I will be posting some failures and looks that make me REALLY, REALLY uncomfortable. I don't need feedback on a lot of them because I do feel that I have a sense of what style I wish to project and what colours go with what. Like Moon, yourself, skirtsdad, Fred, Tom, Steve, Carl to name just a few off the top of my head I am comfortable and confident with what I wear. That doesn't mean that I don't try several skirts on with various tops ( where has that scenario come up before ) before making my choice and going out of the door.

Steve, we do consider a visit to Scotlandshire on occasions but we think more of Edinburgh or Glasgow and don't see us thinking about as far up as you are. North-east Scotland translates to Aberdeen to me and I don't think that there is anything up there that I could persuade MOH to visit for the time and distance involved. A meeting of the four of us would be, ah, interesting, to say the least. It's a pity that you're so far away.

10:40 postscript. I've had a good day so far, sunny but cool and warm enough for a T-shirt. In the chemist there were 7 women and me and I was the only one in a skirt, purple, bodycon, above knee. One of the assistants admitted that she hadn't worn a skirt seriously in over 10 years and had very few. None of them cared that I was in a skirt and admitted that it suited me. In the charity shop I had a conversation with Chris, the female assistant, about what style of skirt I was comfortable wearing and she agreed that if I feel comfortable then probably no-one would take any notice. I also said that I was on the lookout for a small bag with shoulder strap, black or white or a satchel as when I was wearing a skirt with no pockets .... We looked at some but none felt right for me but at least they can keep a lookout.